Explosion/power weapon/grenade overuse.

[UnrealFlash2007]

Not one, single gametype in Halo Reach doesn't have a cluster of 10 year olds bolting for the nearest power weapon/rocket launcher or lobbing grenades everywhere and then running away when I shoot them with the DMR.

 

It's absolutely ridiculous, Armour lock doesn't help because either you don't have enough time to use it, or his buddies come up and gangbang your helpless soon to be lifeless body.

 

I'm well aware this is a community forum but there's no way in hell this can be seen as skilled.

I've been killed by Power Weapons, and grenades (or to be more accurate, heat-seeking missiles) more often than by normal weapons.

 

Why not just have a playlist with no Power Weapons and no grenades? I'm not aware if MLG has those settings and I can't find a match regardless. And even though my K/D is positive, I still don't know why because I'm killed twenty trillion times by someone chucking grenades like a monkey into whatever room I'm in and getting a cheap kill.

 

Does anyone know a playlist without Grenades and Powerweapons that isn't Grifball?

[Fishy]

Or you could just grab the power weapons first?

[UnrealFlash2007]

Thing is, I never seem to spawn beside the power weapons, or care to know where they are.

Along with that I feel cheap using them, so I rarely do, unless taking out a scorpion or Wraith camped outside my spawn point.

[Mr. Bashful Brute]

Go play SWAT if you dont like power weapons. DMR's for daysss.

 

But seriously, you're complaining because people take the time to memorize power weapon location/spawn times? Thats called map control. At least its not like Halo 4 where you dont even have to work for your power weapon, you just wait for it to literally fall from the sky.

[UnrealFlash2007]

Map control?

 

Pretty sure that just revolves around luck actually. You spawn next to a rocket launcher, you're definitely going to get a few kills, you don't? You're ******. There's no counter to it, so if a guy camps around the spawn point, you can't do much to get it yourself.

 

Problem with SWAT is that it's a one shot kill, which also just involves you see the enemy first rather than aim.

 

[Mr. Bashful Brute]

Map control? Pretty sure that just revolves around luck actually. 

 

Halo is all about map control. Least it used to be. In Reach, if your team uses power weapons and certain positions on the map effectively you will gain map control. And if you know how to do it right, you can "set up" on the enemy's side of the map and suppress them, quite often to the point of spawn killing. Of course, communication and callouts are key, and all of that combined wont get you anywhere without at least a small bit of skill.

 

: There's no counter to it, so if a guy camps around the spawn point, you can't do much to get it yourself. 

 

 

You must be new to Halo... All weapons and vehicles have a respawn timer to them. 

[rrhuntington]

I'll agree to Grenade overuse in only one gamemode, which is Multi-team. Of course it will happen there, because there are usually very CQC maps being played. If you play Multi-team, prepare to die by grenades at least 4 or 5 times in the match.

 

Other than that instance, no. It's just a natural instinct it seems, that if someone has grenades, and you are in the room behind the corner, than they will chuck grenades at the threshold. But I think a lot of people would do the same if someone jumped into the room. Just lay a grenade down for your entrance, and say goodbye to your shields.

 

Armor Lock has always been one of the most hated things to bless Halo, I'll offer no argument there.

 

Power Weapons, it's all about the struggle to reach them. They've always been there like that. (besides Halo 4) Race them to it, and beat them to a pulp for even attemting to take your weapons. That's the mindset I use. If they do get their paws on them, then just be aware of that player. Try to give his power weapon a disadvantage by having leverage, or acting irrational in your movements. Once again, Multi-team does have blue team spawn next to the rocket on ascension. I don't know of any other instance however. 

[UnrealFlash2007]

"Halo is all about map control. Least it used to be. In Reach, if your team uses power weapons and certain positions on the map effectively you will gain map control. And if you know how to do it right, you can "set up" on the enemy's side of the map and suppress them, quite often to the point of spawn killing. Of course, communication and callouts are key, and all of that combined wont get you anywhere without at least a small bit of skill."

 

I'm not new to Halo necessarily, been playing since 2007. Halo 3, where again Grenade spam was prevalent.

In reach, map control can be gained, but if you haven't got sprint, or some ability that allows you to immediately rush to the nearest power weapons, there's nothing a normal DMR or assault rifle can do to counter it, other than hope the user has a god-awful aim or used up his ammo previously. It's even worse when your team is incompetent half the time, and so you're hopelessly gunned down by most players.

 

As for grenades, good luck not getting slaughtered by them either, Armour lock doesn't last long enough to save you from the endless barrage of grenades hurled at you, people like to run away and throw a few grenades and get a cheap kill rather than spend time actually aiming their gun.

[Mr. Bashful Brute]

I'm not new to Halo necessarily, been playing since 2007. Halo 3, where again Grenade spam was prevalent. In reach, map control can be gained, but if you haven't got sprint, or some ability that allows you to immediately rush to the nearest power weapons, there's nothing a normal DMR or assault rifle can do to counter it, other than hope the user has a god-awful aim or used up his ammo previously. 

 

Um no, fastest doesn't necessarily always win. Take the Spire Banshee rush for example. Normally Red Team wins because they sprint to the ghost, and race over to Banshee. But if you have a good team of 8, you can all jetpack straight up and teamshot red team's ghost so they don't get Banshee. 

[The Director]

Before I begin, I want you to know that I know where you are coming from. There are very few things more frustrating than being killed by a power weapon or a grenade in a "cheap" way. That being said though, I can tell you that Grenade Spam has been prevalent and complained about in every Halo title that had a popular competitive multiplayer matchmaking with the exception of Halo Wars and Spartan Assault.

 

There has been a lot of time and effort put into figuring out the reason why people spam grenades, and how to stop it. The why? Because it could get you a kill and help your team win. How to stop it? Completely remove grenades. Which isn't going to happen.

 

Here's a few of things that have been found to cause grenade spam:

1. Counter-nading: When someone throws a grenade at you, one of your first instincts is to fight fire with fire. When teams are in close proximity to each other, this immediately results in grenade spamming. Even when players respawn, they've been found to be twice as likely to use their grenades if they died of nade-spam.

2. Preemptive defense: Going into armor lock at the first sign of an enemy (or popping a bubble shield) increases your chance of death by grenade by a ton. First instinct when you see someone go into AL? Blow 'em up.

3. Choke-points: Grenades are most likely to be employed when their are multiple opponents grouped together. In maps with narrow passages, this increases the likely-hood of this and thereby causes grenade spam.

 

Here's some things that have been done so far to try to curb grenade spam:

1. Grenade Nerfing: This actually had the opposite effect. It caused players to have to throw the grenades with near pinpoint accuracy, or throw a bunch of them. Guess which happened.

2. Defenses against grenades: Primarily the Bubble Shield and Armor Lock, both of these also had the opposite effect. When someone pops a bubble shield, you have three choices. You go in the shield to kill them, you wait for a bit and toss grenades, or you run away. The option most chosen was the grenade option, because even if your grenades don't kill them it weakens them enough for you to get a kill. When someone goes into Armor Lock, it prevents them from being immediately killed, but also prevents them from moving. Which gives you time to aim your grenade. Tossing a grenade at someone using AL also works to KEEP them in AL (for fear of blowing up) while you figure out how best to handle them.

3. Increased time between throws: This one is rather subtle, but was intended to decrease grenade spam. Basically, instead of lobbing two grenades almost simultaneously, you had a pause before you could throw another. As you can tell, this didn't work.

 

There are a couple of other things, but it's past midnight and I'm tired so I won't list them all. There is only one thing that can be done to eliminate grenade spam, and that is to eliminate the grenades. Another thing that has been considered but was rejected was making players switch from weapons to grenades. Reason it was rejected was that it would be clumsy, and it wouldn't prevent nade-spam because now the grenades are the players primary weapon.

 

As far as power weapons, the only thing you can do is get there first. Unless you've got a team you can communicate with (because Halo is a team game), your odds of dying from power weapons go down dramatically if you actually pick them up first. In Halo Reach, you can actually learn where they are and make it a point to get there before your opponents (which is actually something that you are supposed to do if you are playing MLG style) and pick them up. Using them is your own decision, but denying your opponent the use of them is a good way to win.

 

The ONLY gametype that doesn't feature power weapons or grenades while still being a competitive slayer gametype is SWAT. I see someone suggested that and your response was "Problem with SWAT is that it's a one shot kill, which also just involves you see the enemy first rather than aim." I'mma argue with you on that one a bit, because I quit slayer due to grenade spam and now prefer SWAT and Snipers..

 

1. SWAT is only 1sk if you hit your opponents head. Default centering of the targeting reticle puts it over your opponents chest. Which means you literally have to aim for their head to get a 1sk. Even melee is at least 2sk. Either one shot one punch, or two punches. Firing at the body means you have to hit them five times to get a kill, which is plenty of time to line up a reticle on someone's dome.

2. Seeing the enemy first is a big advantage, as that allows you to fire the first shot. However, if you are going against a skilled opponent and you miss the first shot (or hit their back rather than their head), they are going to pwn you. If you desire proof of this, ask the moderator GSD to go 1v1 with you in a game of SWAT. You will then see the skill required to land the headshot first every time.

3. SWAT takes a learning curve. If you are new to it and playing against those with experience in it, you will lose (unless you are some sort of freak of nature "natural"). This means it requires learning a skill to be proficient at, which in turn makes it a skill-based gametype.

[Mr. Bashful Brute]

 

2. Preemptive defense: Going into armor lock at the first sign of an enemy (or popping a bubble shield) increases your chance of death by grenade by a ton. First instinct when you see someone go into AL? Blow 'em up.

 

2. Defenses against grenades: Primarily the Bubble Shield and Armor Lock, both of these also had the opposite effect. When someone pops a bubble shield, you have three choices. You go in the shield to kill them, you wait for a bit and toss grenades, or you run away. The option most chosen was the grenade option, because even if your grenades don't kill them it weakens them enough for you to get a kill. When someone goes into Armor Lock, it prevents them from being immediately killed, but also prevents them from moving. Which gives you time to aim your grenade. Tossing a grenade at someone using AL also works to KEEP them in AL (for fear of blowing up) while you figure out how best to handle them.

 

Agreed with you on everything except for encouraging the use of Armor Lock. That's the one thing I think should have never been added to Halo. Totally broke the game.

[The Director]

Agreed with you on everything except for encouraging the use of Armor Lock. That's the one thing I think should have never been added to Halo. Totally broke the game.

How was I encouraging the use of AL?

[Mr. Bashful Brute]

How was I encouraging the use of AL?

 

 

 

...Going into armor lock at the first sign of an enemy...

[The Director]

The Director, on 31 Jul 2014 - 04:24 AM, said:

 

 

How was I encouraging the use of AL?

 

The Director, on 30 Jul 2014 - 12:52 AM, said:

 

 

...Going into armor lock at the first sign of an enemy...

 

Here's a few of things that have been found to cause grenade spam:

 

2. Preemptive defense: Going into armor lock at the first sign of an enemy (or popping a bubble shield) increases your chance of death by grenade by a ton. First instinct when you see someone go into AL? Blow 'em up.

 

And in context, not so much. I mean, one SHOULD think death by explosion the exact opposite of encouragement, right?

[Mr. Bashful Brute]

And in context, not so much. I mean, one SHOULD think death by explosion the exact opposite of encouragement, right?

 Haha, thought it said "DEcreases your chance of death " lol