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343: Halo 4 Ranking System?


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#21 Tyranttttt

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Posted 26 June 2012 - 07:40 AM

I feel so strongly about Halo and its impact on my life that I decided to create an account simply to voice my thoughts on an aspect of Halo 4 that I think desperately needs addressed. I will share with you what lured me into Halo and what has repelled me from halo as of late.

Firstly: I have been playing halo since six months prior to the release of Halo 2 (2004)

Secondly: I have enjoyed the privilege of thousands of games, countless friendships, Several local tournaments and 4 MLG appearances.

Thirdly: I am 28 years old, Hold a B.S. and am studying for my Masters, am a certified teacher in the state of Texas and have ran my own company for two years.

Halo 2 was a great game. Halo 3 was a great game. Reach is a good game but is lacking a fundamental aspect that makes Halo appealing. The addition of bloom and armor abilities were damaging to the mechanics of Halo, but the single most damaging thing that has happened to halo is the ranking system. Apart from the fun and the game play itself, the number rank in halo 2 was what drew me in. I wanted to level up because it was a tangible reflection on my skill increasing. I wanted to out level my friends and in turn they would try harder to out-level me. The ranking system required that you developed teamwork and communication or you would get steamrolled in the team playlists. If you were an aspiring MLG gamer, which I became around 2006, it gave you the chance to match up against players of a higher caliber. MLG aside the first two years of my Halo experience I didn't know what a gaming tournament was. I simply wanted to get 3 of my buddies together and try to dominate the world. We used to play team slayer for hours on end. Each level we progressed the matches got more and more intense. It was such a rush. It was so fun. The fun continued until the release of Reach. I do not dislike the Mechanics of Reach. I dislike the Armor abilities and the bloom but the thing that was absolutely essential to the halo experience was destroyed. Now when a group of buddies and myself go into team slayer the skill level is so out of whack. We play against people with negative K/D ratios all the time and destroy them. The gimmicks need to be removed. The robotic arms and the confetti and the inclement weather and armor lock. The playlists need to be sheared down to a hand full of simple lists. If you want zombies, make a custom. Get that playlist out of halo. If you want grifball, make a custom. It needs to be simply divided between ranked and unranked. Ranked has no armor abilities, no bloom, and 1-50 rank. Unranked has all the bloom, armor abilities, and all the gimmicks. Unranked can have all the eclipse rankings and inheritor rankings but leave that out of Ranked please. This is one lifelong fan who doesn't want this franchise to disappear.

Thank you for your time.



#22 Tyranttttt

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Posted 26 June 2012 - 07:56 AM

This is exactly how I feel. I am also a competitive halo player who dislikes the idea of catering more-so to the casual gamer without considering what the competitive gamer wants. After scanning the forums and google, I have seen so many people who want the halo 2 system back. I couldn't agree more. This was the perfect system for competitive gamers. It completely leveled the playing field. Perhaps implement a way to detect boosting/team killing and punish these people instead of changing the dynamics of your system. True skill was great in Halo 3 but I felt that it was to easy to get a 50. That being said about the ranking system, please steer AWAY from Call of Duty. What I mean by this is do away with the armor abilities(perks) and the sprint. I speak on behalf of the entire top 10 percentile of halo 3's competitive players when I say that sprint and armor abilities totally wrecks halo 3s integrity. The trilogies success came from improving the good qualities already imbedded in the previous game and not adding something completely foreign. Do us, and yourselves a favor and steer in the opposite direction of Reach, 343I.

#23 willtr03

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Posted 28 June 2012 - 06:29 AM

I would love to see a mash of Halo 3 MP and Halo reaches MP, I really both enjoyed them, I hope they mix it or create something new, but no losing your rank when you lose, because that never happened in a halo game, and I don't want to find out I lost a rank because some idiot had to go to the bathroom making him the AFK kill target


I personally think that not losing a rank when you lose is the worst idea ever. If you have something to lose (your rank) then it will keep people from going to visit the bathroom or anything else during a game because they will know they might lose the game and lose ranking. When there is no ranking system based on if you win/lose thats when people quit out of games more and quit playing for a period of time in between games because they know there is no consequence for it. If you didn't want to lose rank for losing a game in Halo 2/3 then thats what the social games were for, they didn't have a rank.

I do think it is sad to for me to say it but it really is true, if halo 4 doesn't have a ranking system like halo 2 or 3 then that will be the difference of me buying the game versus renting it (since all I do is play multiplayer and not single player). I played countless hours of halo 2 and 3 and still go back to halo 3 (and wishing I could go back to halo 2 to play online) because the multiplayer is competitive. I hate games like COD where all it takes to "lvl up" or gain more armour abilities is time playing, not skill. When this happens then you have a bunch of people with no lives that are the highest rank with everything unlocked because they have the time to play not because they are good. This takes all of the competitiveness out of the game because no one works together because in the end it doesn't matter if your team wins or loses just if you personally did well. I believe this is one reason that halo 2/3 was so good, it motivated people to talk and strategize with teamates and try and get a team together to go in and play. I also believe a ranking system helped match people of even skill up better, in other games just because you had a high rank didn't mean you were good so you would get matched up with people that just had time to play and not matched up against people who were of similar skill. I do think they did just fine in halo 3, they had the social matched for the casual gamer and the ranked matched for the competitive gamer. Yes the casual gamer is a big money base for them but I only think they are a money base for a while until the causal gamer moves on to another game, the competitive gamer is what will keep the game around.

I believe with halo reach they were trying way to hard to cater to the causal gamer way too much and they were becoming very similar to COD. I want a game that I can go in and play competively against other players with a reward for wining the game and a penalty for losing it. I just really hope that they realize that the ranking system in Halo 2/3 was what kept people around playing it for so long and put it back into halo 4. Overall I think it would be possible for them to do a combination of both systems so they can have the pointless "armour unlocks" and the such but still have a ranking system.

#24 (DUgF) DGenerateKiller

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Posted 28 June 2012 - 01:03 PM

I've said this in countless other similar threads.. If you want competitiveness so bad and say it's going to be a game breaker if they don't go back to an older ranking system, then get on gamebattles cause u rank up and down on the game leaderboards there, and if it's not good enough for you still, then just dont buy the game. You won't be missed. Seriously if you are a true halo fan you are more interested in seeing the continuation of the story. And even if it's not directly built into the game, there are MANY sources for competition if you really want it that bad, if you are as much of a hardcore halo player that you think you are that is, such as gamenattles.com, fraggednation.com, and ggl.com.
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#25 Baby Boo

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Posted 28 June 2012 - 02:29 PM

I have posted a thread on this matter, how the ranking system will work. Unfortunately, no, it is not the halo 2 ranking system. I will explain, as I had in another thread as well:


To summarize, they are merging the halo reach ranking system and the halo 3 ranking system. How this works, is that they have brought back a variant of halo reach credits. They are different, however. Credits now are not used for ranking up, but only to purchase armor, weapons, equipment, and other things for your custom loadout. Also, they are no longer called credits. They do not yet have an official name for them, but they are temporarily called "Spartan Points".


Now, the halo 3 aspect. They implemented the idea of halo 3's system, by again making it 1-50, with a corresponding symbol from reach, that may be altered. They have also brought back EXP. This is what will rank you up to the next level. EXP is presumably earned how it was in halo 3; winning games. We are unsure how many games you must win for however much EXP, however.


Like I had touched on a little in the above text, your rank will appear as a symbol as well as a number. I am not certain, but I think the symbols may be the same as halo reach. So with that, I will use an example. You have just started playing, and you rank up from Recruit, or level one. You would then rank up to Private, Level two. And so on, until you are an Inheritor, Level Fifty.


I hope this explanation cleared things up for those that were wondering. Thank you for reading!

-Bullet


#26 Chainsaw Samurai

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Posted 29 June 2012 - 08:33 AM

Why shouldn't they provide for the casual players? Its a major money base for them.


Easy. Have ranked/unranked playlists, all are happy. The question you should ask is: Why shouldn't they provide for the HALO players? It's a major money base for them.

Also, does 343i even read these forums? There's some pretty intense insight that is being ignored.

#27 SweatyBagels

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Posted 29 June 2012 - 08:37 AM

Easy. Have ranked/unranked playlists, all are happy. The question you should ask is: Why shouldn't they provide for the HALO players? It's a major money base for them.

Also, does 343i even read these forums? There's some pretty intense insight that is being ignored.


I'm sure that there are members of 343i staff that lurk on here and listen to ideas.
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#28 dmb4134

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Posted 29 June 2012 - 08:40 AM

Dear 343,

I know this has been said countless of times, but I feel that this needs to be iterated.

Halo Reach active community: 120,000
Halo 2-3 active community: 400,000+

What's the difference in these games? The ranking system.

DO NOT CATER TO CASUAL PLAYERS. Games outside the FPS genre have done this and died.
You sacrifice keeping the casual players for game addictiveness and real competition. Halo 2 was by far the most addictive and intense game I've ever played.

You should lose rank for losing, gain rank for winning.
We all realize that you won't be able to use the ELO ranking system, which is by far the best.
Atleast try for Halo 3's Trueskill w/1-50 (or even 100).

Please know your ranking system will determine the life and growth of your game. Having a rank = bragging rights and shows skill. Having credits = how long you've played. Please don't mess this up, I love the Halo series far too much.

I feel that 343 should openly discuss with its current active community the ranking system so we could have a say on opinion on it.

Signed,
H1 Player, countless played
H2 Player, over 10000 MM games played
H3 Player, over 6000 MM games played
Reach player, a few weeks, then quit


THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT I AM TALKING ABOUT! Reach flopped miserably because the only ranking they had was arena, and that was terrible! I like how H3 incorporated a number rank (1-50) along with a military rank to show how long you played. The only problem there was, it didn't take too long to hit 50/the highest military rank. I like how reach made it very time consuming to become an inheritor (I am only an eclipse), but that doesnt mean **** unless there is some sort of skill rank associated with that.

H4 will literally lie in the hands of its ranking system. H2 was amazing, H3 was pretty good, Reach was **** in regards to its ranking system. I love reach, but it would have been so much better if it had a legitimate ranking structure. Also, it needs a ton more armor customizations. In reach after about 4m cR I have everything worth getting, and now am stuck with another 4m cR that will just continue to stock up

I have such a great vision on how I would structure the ranking system, but this post will probably be ignored by 343 anyway.

But you must keep in mind that the casual gamer is just that...a casual gamer. They will fade off eventually anyway. If you don't cater at least 75% to real competition, then you will have no community of players. Look at WoW for example. They have done so well, yes because of the great product they offer, but because they catered to hardcore gamers. It was addicting and even turned some casual gamers to play more than they would normally. A GAME SHOULD NOT CATER TO CASUAL GAMERS - YET IT SHOULD BE SUCH A GREAT GAME THAT IT CAPTURES THE CASUAL GAMER AND TURNS THEM INTO BIGGER GAMERS.

#29 Baby Boo

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Posted 29 June 2012 - 12:39 PM

Did any of you even read my post? I told you what the ranking system will be like! I know, it is a fairly long read, but if you read it at least you know. And yes, 343 staff do check these forums daily, as far as my knowledge goes.

#30 dmb4134

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Posted 29 June 2012 - 12:55 PM

Did any of you even read my post? I told you what the ranking system will be like! I know, it is a fairly long read, but if you read it at least you know. And yes, 343 staff do check these forums daily, as far as my knowledge goes.


Where did you get the information from?

#31 SweatyBagels

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Posted 29 June 2012 - 01:17 PM

Where did you get the information from?


I believe it was from the smartglass E3 demo.
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